Discussion:
Do I have to give up on sonic.net's Fusion service? Unable to resolve drop-outs.
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sms
2014-01-08 00:28:41 UTC
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I'm having continuous dropouts on my Sonic.net DSL. I replaced the
whole house splitter. I have tried four different ADSL modems. I now
have the modem connected directly to the AT&T's junction box outside,
with a new twisted pair cord with RJ11 plugs on both ends, to totally
eliminate the house wiring from the equation.

It has to be an issue somewhere between the modem and Sonic, either the
AT&T wiring or Sonic's D-SLAM, but their tech support says that their
testing shows no wiring problems so they won't send AT&T out. They will
come out but there's nothing they can really do since it's not the house
wiring, it's not the modem (unless four different ADSL modems are all
bad), it's not the short twisted-pair cord between the modem and AT&T's
junction box, and (according them) it's not the AT&T wiring.

Anyone have any ideas of what I can try, or what I can say to them?

While I despise AT&T, I'm thinking of getting U-Verse plus an Ooma box
for voice. Then I'll have to pay for VPN service separately, but so it goes.
Roy
2014-01-08 01:04:46 UTC
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Post by sms
I'm having continuous dropouts on my Sonic.net DSL. I replaced the
whole house splitter. I have tried four different ADSL modems. I now
have the modem connected directly to the AT&T's junction box outside,
with a new twisted pair cord with RJ11 plugs on both ends, to totally
eliminate the house wiring from the equation.
It has to be an issue somewhere between the modem and Sonic, either the
AT&T wiring or Sonic's D-SLAM, but their tech support says that their
testing shows no wiring problems so they won't send AT&T out. They will
come out but there's nothing they can really do since it's not the house
wiring, it's not the modem (unless four different ADSL modems are all
bad), it's not the short twisted-pair cord between the modem and AT&T's
junction box, and (according them) it's not the AT&T wiring.
Anyone have any ideas of what I can try, or what I can say to them?
While I despise AT&T, I'm thinking of getting U-Verse plus an Ooma box
for voice. Then I'll have to pay for VPN service separately, but so it goes.
I can highly recommend VPNGATE especially at the price (free)

http://www.vpngate.net/en/

I installed the SoftEther VPN manager and the VPNGATE plugin. I get a
list of numerous servers and randomly select one in the US. If that one
doesn't work or perform well, I simply select another.

It runs on Windows, Mac, Iphone, Ipad, and Android
sms
2014-01-08 01:18:10 UTC
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Post by Roy
It runs on Windows, Mac, Iphone, Ipad, and Android
Sounds good, if it's trustworthy.

I'll be really bummed to have to drop sonic.net, but this has been going
on for months now and I'm out of options.
David Kaye
2014-01-08 03:03:50 UTC
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They will come out but there's nothing they can really do since it's not
the house wiring, it's not the modem (unless four different ADSL modems
are all bad),
If you remember I have a client who got two bad Zyxel modem/routers in a row
from Sonic. One kept flaking out with DHCP and the other couldn't connect
consistently. And these Zyxels are supposed to be top of the line. It took
lots of phone calls to convince Sonic to send out a 3rd one.
it's not the short twisted-pair cord between the modem and AT&T's junction
box, and (according them) it's not the AT&T wiring.
Anyone have any ideas of what I can try, or what I can say to them?
I know this may sound stupid, but rather than the modems have you checked
your router?
sms
2014-01-08 03:07:28 UTC
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Post by David Kaye
They will come out but there's nothing they can really do since it's not
the house wiring, it's not the modem (unless four different ADSL modems
are all bad),
If you remember I have a client who got two bad Zyxel modem/routers in a row
from Sonic. One kept flaking out with DHCP and the other couldn't connect
consistently. And these Zyxels are supposed to be top of the line. It took
lots of phone calls to convince Sonic to send out a 3rd one.
it's not the short twisted-pair cord between the modem and AT&T's junction
box, and (according them) it's not the AT&T wiring.
Anyone have any ideas of what I can try, or what I can say to them?
I know this may sound stupid, but rather than the modems have you checked
your router?
They are all modem/router combinations.
Kevin McMurtrie
2014-01-08 05:32:48 UTC
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Post by sms
I'm having continuous dropouts on my Sonic.net DSL. I replaced the
whole house splitter. I have tried four different ADSL modems. I now
have the modem connected directly to the AT&T's junction box outside,
with a new twisted pair cord with RJ11 plugs on both ends, to totally
eliminate the house wiring from the equation.
It has to be an issue somewhere between the modem and Sonic, either the
AT&T wiring or Sonic's D-SLAM, but their tech support says that their
testing shows no wiring problems so they won't send AT&T out. They will
come out but there's nothing they can really do since it's not the house
wiring, it's not the modem (unless four different ADSL modems are all
bad), it's not the short twisted-pair cord between the modem and AT&T's
junction box, and (according them) it's not the AT&T wiring.
Anyone have any ideas of what I can try, or what I can say to them?
While I despise AT&T, I'm thinking of getting U-Verse plus an Ooma box
for voice. Then I'll have to pay for VPN service separately, but so it goes.
First check for a rusty looking terminal block where your wires come in.
That's an old surge suppressor that needs to be replaced by AT&T. It's
their responsibility to do so.

Try hooking up a phone through a DSL filter. Leave it off the hook
until the beeping stops (it's not loud on Sonic). Now see if you still
get carrier dropouts. If you do, listen for crackling on the phone.

If the dropouts stop or you hear crackling, there's a loose wire and
AT&T will never fix it. I'm not saying it's the right thing to do, but
an extremely high dv/dt power surge, like a small capacitor charged to
10KV and touched to the wires, fixes it ;) Your other option is to
cancel your service or sweet-talk a service tech into swapping your
wires.

If the line is clear but dropouts continue, check the SNR (Signal to
Noise Ratio) margin on the modem's diagnostics page. That's how much
extra signal you have before data is lost. You need enough to cover
normal fluctuations in line quality so that you don't loose too much
signal. It should average at least 3dB on clean lines, 6dB on normal
lines, or even over 10dB on dirty lines. The target SNR is configurable
and it's possible for mistakes to be made during account activation.
sms
2014-01-08 14:25:59 UTC
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Post by Kevin McMurtrie
Post by sms
I'm having continuous dropouts on my Sonic.net DSL. I replaced the
whole house splitter. I have tried four different ADSL modems. I now
have the modem connected directly to the AT&T's junction box outside,
with a new twisted pair cord with RJ11 plugs on both ends, to totally
eliminate the house wiring from the equation.
It has to be an issue somewhere between the modem and Sonic, either the
AT&T wiring or Sonic's D-SLAM, but their tech support says that their
testing shows no wiring problems so they won't send AT&T out. They will
come out but there's nothing they can really do since it's not the house
wiring, it's not the modem (unless four different ADSL modems are all
bad), it's not the short twisted-pair cord between the modem and AT&T's
junction box, and (according them) it's not the AT&T wiring.
Anyone have any ideas of what I can try, or what I can say to them?
While I despise AT&T, I'm thinking of getting U-Verse plus an Ooma box
for voice. Then I'll have to pay for VPN service separately, but so it goes.
First check for a rusty looking terminal block where your wires come in.
That's an old surge suppressor that needs to be replaced by AT&T. It's
their responsibility to do so.
Are you talking about the junction box on the side of the house? It was
replaced in about 2001 when I first got sDSL. It looks very good.
Post by Kevin McMurtrie
Try hooking up a phone through a DSL filter. Leave it off the hook
until the beeping stops (it's not loud on Sonic). Now see if you still
get carrier dropouts. If you do, listen for crackling on the phone.
If the dropouts stop or you hear crackling, there's a loose wire and
AT&T will never fix it. I'm not saying it's the right thing to do, but
an extremely high dv/dt power surge, like a small capacitor charged to
10KV and touched to the wires, fixes it ;) Your other option is to
cancel your service or sweet-talk a service tech into swapping your
wires.
They ran new wiring from the BBox to my house in 2001 when I got Covad
sDSL (I did not have two pairs until then and sDSL needed it's own
pair). It could still be a loose wire I guess, but it's not 1960's
wiring anymore, at least up to the pole.

But I'll try that today (not the power surge though).
Post by Kevin McMurtrie
If the line is clear but dropouts continue, check the SNR (Signal to
Noise Ratio) margin on the modem's diagnostics page. That's how much
extra signal you have before data is lost. You need enough to cover
normal fluctuations in line quality so that you don't loose too much
signal. It should average at least 3dB on clean lines, 6dB on normal
lines, or even over 10dB on dirty lines. The target SNR is configurable
and it's possible for mistakes to be made during account activation.
sms
2014-01-08 17:58:48 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Kevin McMurtrie
Post by sms
I'm having continuous dropouts on my Sonic.net DSL. I replaced the
whole house splitter. I have tried four different ADSL modems. I now
have the modem connected directly to the AT&T's junction box outside,
with a new twisted pair cord with RJ11 plugs on both ends, to totally
eliminate the house wiring from the equation.
It has to be an issue somewhere between the modem and Sonic, either the
AT&T wiring or Sonic's D-SLAM, but their tech support says that their
testing shows no wiring problems so they won't send AT&T out. They will
come out but there's nothing they can really do since it's not the house
wiring, it's not the modem (unless four different ADSL modems are all
bad), it's not the short twisted-pair cord between the modem and AT&T's
junction box, and (according them) it's not the AT&T wiring.
Anyone have any ideas of what I can try, or what I can say to them?
While I despise AT&T, I'm thinking of getting U-Verse plus an Ooma box
for voice. Then I'll have to pay for VPN service separately, but so it goes.
First check for a rusty looking terminal block where your wires come in.
That's an old surge suppressor that needs to be replaced by AT&T. It's
their responsibility to do so.
Try hooking up a phone through a DSL filter. Leave it off the hook
until the beeping stops (it's not loud on Sonic). Now see if you still
get carrier dropouts. If you do, listen for crackling on the phone.
If the dropouts stop or you hear crackling, there's a loose wire and
AT&T will never fix it. I'm not saying it's the right thing to do, but
an extremely high dv/dt power surge, like a small capacitor charged to
10KV and touched to the wires, fixes it ;) Your other option is to
cancel your service or sweet-talk a service tech into swapping your
wires.
If the line is clear but dropouts continue, check the SNR (Signal to
Noise Ratio) margin on the modem's diagnostics page. That's how much
extra signal you have before data is lost. You need enough to cover
normal fluctuations in line quality so that you don't loose too much
signal. It should average at least 3dB on clean lines, 6dB on normal
lines, or even over 10dB on dirty lines. The target SNR is configurable
and it's possible for mistakes to be made during account activation.
LOL, I posted on the Sonic.net forum and low and behold, and unannounced
to me, AT&T was in front of my house when I got back from taking my kid
to school this morning at 9:00 a.m.. Normally I'm not home at this time
and the gate is locked so it would have been nice to know that they were
coming.

He tested the line and found the same thing that Sonic did remotely, the
line is fine. The AT&T tech checked it at my house and at their box
(next to their U-Verse box).

He said that I was really too far to have aDSL (10220 ft). I think that
that's a big part of the problem. I really am so far from the CO that
aDSL is just not a great idea--when the alternative was dial-up it was
different).

I now plugged in a Zoom modem/router (which I hate because the wireless
on it is really weak). They said that they are still seeing dropouts.

I do have real Uverse in my neighborhood, so that's one option. The
other option is Comcast. I've never had cable service and I traced the
cable TV wire from the pole and it ends up in the garage where it's
chopped off. So it must date from the last century from before we moved
in. There are no cable outlets in the house at all. But it would not be
difficult to run a cable into the wiring closet.
David Kaye
2014-01-10 04:15:50 UTC
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Post by sms
He said that I was really too far to have aDSL (10220 ft). I think that
that's a big part of the problem. I really am so far from the CO that aDSL
is just not a great idea--when the alternative was dial-up it was
different).
If distance is the problem I'd suggest that Sonic stop down the speed a bit.
I had an AT&T customer out at Ocean Beach in SF with similar problems. I
got a tech on the line and she recommended that the speed be slowed. It
worked. I guess there was a collision problem that was alleviated by the
slower speed.
sms
2014-01-11 06:47:45 UTC
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Post by David Kaye
Post by sms
He said that I was really too far to have aDSL (10220 ft). I think that
that's a big part of the problem. I really am so far from the CO that aDSL
is just not a great idea--when the alternative was dial-up it was
different).
If distance is the problem I'd suggest that Sonic stop down the speed a bit.
I had an AT&T customer out at Ocean Beach in SF with similar problems. I
got a tech on the line and she recommended that the speed be slowed. It
worked. I guess there was a collision problem that was alleviated by the
slower speed.
Well they finally did something that made it work. The speed might be a
tad slower, I'm not sure.

They did something after I posted on one of their forums. Then the only
indication I had that they were sending AT&T out was a reply to my post
on their forums--after AT&T had already arrived, advising me to contact
them if I would not be home. That post was on their form about 20
minutes after AT&T was there but I didn't see the post until later anyway.

The AT&T guy was really nice. He said that at my distance that AT&T
would not try to do even 2Mb/s on regular aDSL.

Going forward I'm not sure how much longer 2Mb/s is going to cut it but
at least there's no rush now.
Mr. Allen
2014-01-22 02:55:55 UTC
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On Thu, 9 Jan 2014 20:15:50 -0800, "David Kaye"
Post by David Kaye
Post by sms
He said that I was really too far to have aDSL (10220 ft). I
think that
Post by David Kaye
If distance is the problem I'd suggest that Sonic stop down the speed a bit.
I was at closer to 20,000 feet for Fusion, but the line was pretty
darn clean. Sonic went ahead and did it. It worked perfectly once we
found the right speed settings. It did require a call to support to
get them to set that speed on their equipment so the modem didn't try
to pretend it was mated to a pretty debutant at only 600 feet away
from the CO.

I had rock solid service the entire time I had it. My speed was
somewhere about 800kbps, from what I recall. Pretty snazzy. Nothing
like 100mbps from Comcast. Then again, nothing like 1Gbps from Sonic
fiber, either.

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