Discussion:
Source of IDE Hard Drives?
(too old to reply)
David Kaye
2014-09-25 00:24:07 UTC
Permalink
Someone phoned me this morning asking if I sold IDE hard drives. No. In
fact, I haven't installed a new one in 3 or 4 years. After referring him to
Central Computer, Fry's, etc., he said that he'd tried them and all the
other local retailers and nobody carries them.

Gosh. Does anybody even make IDE drives any longer? Does anyone sell them?




---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com
Thad Floryan
2014-09-25 00:29:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Kaye
Someone phoned me this morning asking if I sold IDE hard drives. No. In
fact, I haven't installed a new one in 3 or 4 years. After referring him to
Central Computer, Fry's, etc., he said that he'd tried them and all the
other local retailers and nobody carries them.
Gosh. Does anybody even make IDE drives any longer? Does anyone sell them?
Hi David,

Easy to find at Amazon and 6.9 million other places Googling:

new ide disk drives for sale

FYI, they're commonly called PATA (Parallel ATA) drives today
contrasted with SATA (Serial ATA) drives.

Thad
Thad Floryan
2014-09-25 00:32:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thad Floryan
Post by David Kaye
Someone phoned me this morning asking if I sold IDE hard drives. No. In
fact, I haven't installed a new one in 3 or 4 years. After referring him to
Central Computer, Fry's, etc., he said that he'd tried them and all the
other local retailers and nobody carries them.
Gosh. Does anybody even make IDE drives any longer? Does anyone sell them?
Hi David,
new ide disk drives for sale
FYI, they're commonly called PATA (Parallel ATA) drives today
contrasted with SATA (Serial ATA) drives.
BTW, Frys does carry them, too. Search for "PATA drives" on Frys
web site.

Thad
Keith Keller
2014-09-25 04:30:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thad Floryan
new ide disk drives for sale
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=new+ide+disk+drives+for+sale

--keith
--
kkeller-***@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us
(try just my userid to email me)
AOLSFAQ=http://www.therockgarden.ca/aolsfaq.txt
see X- headers for PGP signature information
David Kaye
2014-09-25 06:22:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thad Floryan
FYI, they're commonly called PATA (Parallel ATA) drives today
contrasted with SATA (Serial ATA) drives.
Well, yes, that's true. I didn't think to suggest that to him. Well, it
was 10:30am and I was barely awake yet, so I wasn't so quick on the draw.
I'm just happy that I don't have to deal with them much anymore. They get
cranky with old age.




---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com
John Slade
2014-09-27 23:09:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Kaye
Someone phoned me this morning asking if I sold IDE hard drives. No. In
fact, I haven't installed a new one in 3 or 4 years. After referring him to
Central Computer, Fry's, etc., he said that he'd tried them and all the
other local retailers and nobody carries them.
Gosh. Does anybody even make IDE drives any longer? Does anyone sell them?
They still make them and you can find them on Newegg
but you might be buying some old HDs they're palming off as new.
A better solution might be to get an SATA to IDE adapter that
works to convert both ways. Then get a smaller SATA drive.

John
David Kaye
2014-09-28 07:04:56 UTC
Permalink
They still make them and you can find them on Newegg but you might
be buying some old HDs they're palming off as new. A better solution might
be to get an SATA to IDE adapter that works to convert both ways. Then get
a smaller SATA drive.
These aren't for me unless I go into the archive business or something. I
haven't had to deal with PATA/IDE drives in several years. I haven't put in
an adapter, but given the fact that it's converting back and forth between
parallel and serial, I'd think that the throughput would be awful. No?

About archiving, I'm starting to think that an interesting business might be
rescuing old media. Well, for one, Frank Denevi (remember Denevi Cameras?)
sold off his camera biz and went into video and audio transfers -- Super8 to
DVD, cassette to CD, etc. I guess it serves him well since he's since
brought his son into the company and they do business for Walgreen, WalMart,
and even Kodak.

But what about non-audio and video? How about documents, spreadsheets, old
programs? Not long ago I think it was Brewster Kahle from Archive.org who
was mentioning about how fast old formats are fading and how it is
imperative to preserve audio and video as quickly as possible or lose it
forever.

I know that there aren't many 2-inch videotape machines out there anymore
(quad-scan Ampex VR-1200s and the like), so that a lot of videotape that has
been saved is now only playable if someone can find a machine.

So, what about data? 8-inch floppies, 5 1/4 inch floppies, punch cards, Zip
Drives (I was so happy when THAT technology disappeared), 3 1/2 inch
floppies, hard drives, and now even CDs. As the blue dye fades, millions of
terabytes of data will soon fade, too.

I have a feeling that we'll find a world in which the printed word survives,
and safety film stock survives, and LPs and 45s survive, but then I see a
HUGE gap from about 1990 to today that won't survive, as if a big bite had
been taken out of the culture. (Of course that'll also mean that future
generations won't have to deal with Justin Bieber....)

Thoughts?






---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com
Jeff Liebermann
2014-09-28 07:28:35 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 28 Sep 2014 00:04:56 -0700, "David Kaye"
Post by David Kaye
As the blue dye fades, millions of
terabytes of data will soon fade, too.
Maybe not so soon:
<http://www.cd-info.com/archiving/longevity/>
Unrecorded CD-R and CD-RW: 5-10 years
Recorded CD-R: 50-200 years
Recorded CD-RW: 20-100 years
Recorded DVD-R: 30-100 years
Recorded DVD-RW: up to 30 years
Recorded BD-R and BD-RE: 30-200 years
I don't recall seeing any CD/DVD media failures that weren't caused by
mechanical damage. I have seen plenty of drive failures.

I have some hard sectored 8" and 5.25" drives, and DC-600 size tape
drives that I sometimes do data transfers. More often, it's
unreadable or trashed backup media. The conversion biz was lucrative
when CP/M was on its way out, but hasn't produced much revenue since
then. More common are corrupted DDS-1 thru DDS-4 backup tapes due to
drive head wear. If you have the right connections with users of such
media, you'll probably do ok.
--
Jeff Liebermann ***@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
John Slade
2014-09-28 09:39:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Kaye
They still make them and you can find them on Newegg but you might
be buying some old HDs they're palming off as new. A better solution might
be to get an SATA to IDE adapter that works to convert both ways. Then get
a smaller SATA drive.
These aren't for me unless I go into the archive business or something. I
haven't had to deal with PATA/IDE drives in several years. I haven't put in
an adapter, but given the fact that it's converting back and forth between
parallel and serial, I'd think that the throughput would be awful. No?
I've never bought a stand-alone adapter but I have used
one that was built into a motherboard. I used it to make the
SATA HD appear as an IDE HD. It worked fine, no noticeable drop
in performance.
Post by David Kaye
About archiving, I'm starting to think that an interesting business might be
rescuing old media. Well, for one, Frank Denevi (remember Denevi Cameras?)
sold off his camera biz and went into video and audio transfers -- Super8 to
DVD, cassette to CD, etc. I guess it serves him well since he's since
brought his son into the company and they do business for Walgreen, WalMart,
and even Kodak.
Could be a good business to go in. I know many people who
are doing it themselves with software made to transfer video
tapes to digital format.
Post by David Kaye
But what about non-audio and video? How about documents, spreadsheets, old
programs? Not long ago I think it was Brewster Kahle from Archive.org who
was mentioning about how fast old formats are fading and how it is
imperative to preserve audio and video as quickly as possible or lose it
forever.
I have a feeling that we'll find a world in which the printed word survives,
and safety film stock survives, and LPs and 45s survive, but then I see a
HUGE gap from about 1990 to today that won't survive, as if a big bite had
been taken out of the culture. (Of course that'll also mean that future
generations won't have to deal with Justin Bieber....)
Thoughts?
I'm sure much of that data will be preserved. Optical
media such as CDs and DVDs has the potential to store data for
decades if the media is treated properly. There are new storage
technologies coming on the scene in the near future that has the
ability to store data for hundreds of years. I don't think we
have to worry much about network television, music and movies
being lost because current technologies and methods will ensure
that data will be around for a long time to come.

John
David Kaye
2014-09-28 12:42:09 UTC
Permalink
I don't think we have to worry much about network television, music and
movies being lost because current technologies and methods will ensure
that data will be around for a long time to come.
On the other hand, Johnny Carson hosted the Tonight Show for 30 years and
yet very few hours of the show remain. NBC recorded over many of the shows
because 2-inch videotape of show length was expensive. Likewise, Group W
(now CBS) erased most of the 30 years of Merv Griffin's shows.




---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com
Thad Floryan
2014-09-28 19:53:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Kaye
I don't think we have to worry much about network television, music and
movies being lost because current technologies and methods will ensure
that data will be around for a long time to come.
On the other hand, Johnny Carson hosted the Tonight Show for 30 years and
yet very few hours of the show remain. NBC recorded over many of the shows
because 2-inch videotape of show length was expensive. Likewise, Group W
(now CBS) erased most of the 30 years of Merv Griffin's shows.
Hi David,

That would really suck. Is it possible there could have been
transfers to film that still exist? Just curious.

HOWEVER, Googling "archives of johnny carson show" reveals a
lot of archives, many now on DVD, e.g.,

Johnny Carson | Tonight Show Episodes, Clips, DVDs ...
http://www.johnnycarson.com/

Heeerre's Johnny! Carson archives now online - Video on ...
http://www.today.com/video/today/38672493

Johnny Carson - YouTube
http://www.youtube.com/user/johnnycarson

Strolling Through Johnny Carson's Vault via DVD | Splitsider
http://splitsider.com/2013/07/strolling-through-johnny-carsons-vault-via-dvd/

AND THIS ONE which is really good news:

The Tonight Show Starring Johnny Carson (TV Series 1962 ...
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0055708/trivia

where we read:

Five years after the final 'The Tonight Show Starring Johnny
Carson' broadcast aired, 10,000 "Tonight Show" tapes were
transported to a working salt mine in Kansas, 54 stories
underground, to protect them from deterioration. The average
temperature of the salt mine is 68 degrees, with 40% humidity.

so it appears that NOTHING IS MISSING.

Thad
David Kaye
2014-09-28 20:31:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thad Floryan
That would really suck. Is it possible there could have been
transfers to film that still exist? Just curious.
NFL Films is notorious for saving just about everything in football, BUT
there exists no footage on film or video of Super Bowl I or II, I forget.
Post by Thad Floryan
Five years after the final 'The Tonight Show Starring Johnny
Carson' broadcast aired, 10,000 "Tonight Show" tapes were
transported to a working salt mine in Kansas, 54 stories
underground, to protect them from deterioration. The average
temperature of the salt mine is 68 degrees, with 40% humidity.
so it appears that NOTHING IS MISSING.
Johnny Carson himself said that most of the shows are missing, and that when
he learned that NBC was erasing and reusing the tapes, he negotiated with
NBC to buy his shows from then on. Sure, certain shows that were known to
be special events, such as Jack Paar's goodbye from the Tonight Show, were
preserved, but the ordinary shows? Not really.

Now, there might be some Merv Griffin shows extant due to the curious way
syndicated shows were duplicated in ye olden days. A special master tape
was recorded which was highly magnetic. To make duplicates for distribution
to TV stations the master was run, pressed against each blank tape, thus
magnetizing the blank tapes. The master tape, due to its high magnetism,
could only be recorded once; there was no known practical way to erase them.
So some of THOSE might exist, but then again, it's unlikely that anything
but the blockbuster moments were saved. The Huey Newton, John Lennon, and
Tim Leary interviews are preserved, for sure.

I just found a Wikipedia entry: "
a.. Almost all of NBC's The Tonight Show with Jack Paar and the first ten
years (1962-1972) hosted by Johnny Carson were taped over by the network and
no longer exist. The videotape was being used repeatedly, hence the reason
that Carson's Tonight Show picture looked muddy during broadcast in the late
1960s. Selected sequences from the 1962-1972 era survive and were often
replayed by Carson himself (particularly in the months preceding his
retirement in 1992) and have been released to home video. Some Paar episodes
also survive and have also been released to home video-in this case, DVD."





---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com
Thad Floryan
2014-09-28 20:48:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Kaye
Post by Thad Floryan
That would really suck. Is it possible there could have been
transfers to film that still exist? Just curious.
NFL Films is notorious for saving just about everything in football, BUT
there exists no footage on film or video of Super Bowl I or II, I forget.
Post by Thad Floryan
Five years after the final 'The Tonight Show Starring Johnny
Carson' broadcast aired, 10,000 "Tonight Show" tapes were
transported to a working salt mine in Kansas, 54 stories
underground, to protect them from deterioration. The average
temperature of the salt mine is 68 degrees, with 40% humidity.
so it appears that NOTHING IS MISSING.
Johnny Carson himself said that most of the shows are missing, and that when
he learned that NBC was erasing and reusing the tapes, he negotiated with
NBC to buy his shows from then on. Sure, certain shows that were known to
be special events, such as Jack Paar's goodbye from the Tonight Show, were
preserved, but the ordinary shows? Not really.
[...]
I just found a Wikipedia entry: "
Citation please.
Post by David Kaye
a.. Almost all of NBC's The Tonight Show with Jack Paar and the first ten
years (1962-1972) hosted by Johnny Carson were taped over by the network and
no longer exist. The videotape was being used repeatedly, hence the reason
that Carson's Tonight Show picture looked muddy during broadcast in the late
1960s. Selected sequences from the 1962-1972 era survive and were often
replayed by Carson himself (particularly in the months preceding his
retirement in 1992) and have been released to home video. Some Paar episodes
also survive and have also been released to home video-in this case, DVD."
Something is very wrong with all the above.

Assuming Carson did 5 shows a week: 5 * 52 = 260 shows a year

10,000 tapes were placed in the salt mine: 10000/260 = 38.5 years

This page:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Tonight_Show_Starring_Johnny_Carson

says there were 30 seasons with Carson and 4531 episodes

10,000 tapes is more than 4531.

Any guesses as to how many tapes per episode? I would have assumed 1 given
the OP's article stating "because 2-inch videotape of show length was expensive"
yet 10,000 tapes are stored in the salt mine.

Though I occasionally watched the show when it originally aired, I don't care
to watch them again on DVD or the other venues I found in the Google search. I
would be very surprised if any episodes are, in fact, truly "lost".

Thad
Jeff Liebermann
2014-09-28 21:10:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thad Floryan
Any guesses as to how many tapes per episode? I would have assumed 1 given
the OP's article stating "because 2-inch videotape of show length was expensive"
yet 10,000 tapes are stored in the salt mine.
<http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0055708/>
Runtime:
105 min (1962-1966) | 60 min (1980-1992) | 90 min (1967-1980)

The early recordings were probably done on an Ampex 2" VTR:
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ampex_2_inch_helical_VTR>
RECORDING TIME
a. 40 minutes for a 6-1/2 inch reel (750 feet)
b. 90 minutes for an 8 inch reel (1650 feet)
c. 195 minutes (3 hrs 15 min.) for a 6-1/2 inch reel (3600 feet)
d. 300 minutes (5 hrs) for a 12-1/2 inch reel (5540 feet, 1 mile+)

No clue which tape types were used but all but the shortest tape would
record the entire show on one tape.
--
Jeff Liebermann ***@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
Thad Floryan
2014-09-28 21:45:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeff Liebermann
Post by Thad Floryan
Any guesses as to how many tapes per episode? I would have assumed 1 given
the OP's article stating "because 2-inch videotape of show length was expensive"
yet 10,000 tapes are stored in the salt mine.
<http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0055708/>
105 min (1962-1966) | 60 min (1980-1992) | 90 min (1967-1980)
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ampex_2_inch_helical_VTR>
RECORDING TIME
a. 40 minutes for a 6-1/2 inch reel (750 feet)
b. 90 minutes for an 8 inch reel (1650 feet)
c. 195 minutes (3 hrs 15 min.) for a 6-1/2 inch reel (3600 feet)
d. 300 minutes (5 hrs) for a 12-1/2 inch reel (5540 feet, 1 mile+)
No clue which tape types were used but all but the shortest tape would
record the entire show on one tape.
Hi Jeff,

Thanks for the info.

This reminds me of when I recorded the last 48 hours of KFAT (that
was in Gilroy) on my old reel-reel tape drive at the slowest speed
(IIRC 15/16 IPS (that's 0.9375 inches per second)). I played it
once to verify it was recorded and left the tape in played condition
to prevent print-through. For those who don't know, KFAT broadcast,
uh, unusual songs such as "MOOSE TURD PIE", "DROPKICK ME JESUS THROUGH
THE GOALPOSTS OF HEAVEN", and more! :-)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KFAT_%28defunct%29

It was always a hoot to tune it in during BBQs and lots of beer drinking.

Thad
David Kaye
2014-09-29 07:22:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thad Floryan
This reminds me of when I recorded the last 48 hours of KFAT (that
was in Gilroy) on my old reel-reel tape drive at the slowest speed
(IIRC 15/16 IPS (that's 0.9375 inches per second)). I played it
once to verify it was recorded and left the tape in played condition
to prevent print-through. For those who don't know, KFAT broadcast,
uh, unusual songs such as "MOOSE TURD PIE", "DROPKICK ME JESUS THROUGH
THE GOALPOSTS OF HEAVEN", and more! :-)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KFAT_%28defunct%29
Funny story about KFAT. Jeremy Lansman and partners bought Gilroy station
KPER at 94.3 in the mid-70s. The way the FM table of allocations went, the
cities got the Class B/C channels (up to 50kw or 100kw, depending on region)
and the small communities (Livermore, Alameda, Walnut Creek, Gilroy, etc)
got the Class A stations (up to 3kw). The way the table of allocations
went, the channels were organized as B/C, B/C, A, B/C, B/C, A, etc.

KPER went on the air in 1969 I believe. It was a Class A station on 94.3.
The owner couldn't make any money on it. Jeremy bought it and got to
thinking. He wanted to expand the station and flip it and didn't want any
"listener groups" to kill the orderly transfer of the station, as a
"listener group" tried to do a couple years earlier when Pat Henry sold KJAZ
to Ron Cowan and tried to block the sale, even though Cowan promised that he
was buying it FOR the jazz.

But in the meanwhile it would take awhile to petition the FCC to have KPER
re-allocated from a 3kw Class A station on 94.3 to a Class B station on 94.5
where he could run up to 50kw and cover SAN JOSE.

What throwaway format to choose? Well, how about country. Nobody likes
country music (by then KEEN and KSAY had been failing with their Western
music formats), so why not call it KFAT and make it into a country station?
Sure, why not. There wouldn't be any listeners. Then when the FCC approves
the channel change and sells to a new owner there wouldn't be any concern
about flipping it to whatever format the new owner wanted.

Except that KFAT became successful! Highbrow, moneyed people in Silicon
Valley loved KFAT. They were billing some bizarre amount of money from
Mercedes dealerships and whatnot. I think Jeremy once said that KFAT was
billing $60,000 a month just on Mercedes ads alone.

So, that's the story of KFAT, the station that shouldn't have been.




---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com
David Kaye
2014-09-29 06:45:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeff Liebermann
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ampex_2_inch_helical_VTR>
Pre-helical. We're talking quad heads and 2 audio tracks (program audio and
cue/comment track). We're talking the Ampex VR1000 and its color successor
the VR1200. The reels were HUGE. The tape ran at 15 ips for standard
broadcast quality or 30 ips for extremely high quality (for masters for
commercials, etc.) An hour's worth of TV programming took up 4500 feet at
15 ips, loaded on a reel that was as I remember about 15 inches across. It
was a 2-handed job mounting the tape on the machine. The reels of tape
weighed about 10 pounds each. I can't believe there are 10,000 of those
tapes stored anywhere.

Oh, and the VR1200 and its kin came with their own compressor system that
was often mounted outside the building. Y'see, the tape had to be sucked
against a guide so that there were no bends or irregular bends in the tape
as it passed the 4 heads. The heads were mounted on a rotating drum and the
heads were only good for about 500 hours before they had to be replaced. So
a typical TV station would have to replace the heads about once a month on
each machine.

I remember one time working at channel 31 in Sacramento on a particularly
cold, frosty morning in the days when TV stations signed off. We came to
work, started up the equipment, but the compressor for one of the machines
wouldn't start. It was frozen! Then someone (me or someone else, I forget)
got the bright idea of shoving a garden hose into the exhaust pipe of a car,
starting up the car and pumping the exhaust onto parts of the compressor.
After about 5 minutes the compressor started just fine and the TV station
could go on the air.

The wikipedia entry for the 2-inch quad system is inaccurate in many ways,
but gets the gist of the story right.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadruplex_videotape

Here's a photo of the VR1200 with a full-sized take-up reel and a smaller
reel on it. The size of the reel was about 50% larger than a man's HEAD.
Loading Image... Notice how small the buttons and
dials are in comparison.

Even though Ampex and RCA came out with smaller versions, such as the 1-inch
AVR series, etc., the VR1200 was THE workhorse of that era and every TV
station had a couple or 3. So, this is the kind of reel and tape that would
have been used from 1956 until the mid-70s or even later.




---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com
Jeff Liebermann
2014-09-28 20:44:56 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 28 Sep 2014 12:53:10 -0700, Thad Floryan <***@thadlabs.com>
wrote:
(...)
Post by Thad Floryan
so it appears that NOTHING IS MISSING.
Thad
This might help:
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Tonight_Show_Starring_Johnny_Carson#Tape_archives>
"Virtually all of the original pre-1970 video recordings, including
Carson's debut as host, are now considered lost because of wiping."

The archives have most everything from 1972 to 1992. The shows
between 1963 to 1972 are mostly lost. Some recordings have been
rediscovered:
<http://www.stripes.com/news/afn-discovers-johnny-carson-footage-thought-to-be-lost-forever-1.191760>
--
Jeff Liebermann ***@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
Thad Floryan
2014-09-28 21:05:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeff Liebermann
(...)
Post by Thad Floryan
so it appears that NOTHING IS MISSING.
Thad
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Tonight_Show_Starring_Johnny_Carson#Tape_archives>
"Virtually all of the original pre-1970 video recordings, including
Carson's debut as host, are now considered lost because of wiping."
Hi Jeff,

Oops, I didn't read enough of that same page I cited since I was
looking for the total number of episodes since descriptions exist
for all episodes AFAIK.
Post by Jeff Liebermann
The archives have most everything from 1972 to 1992. The shows
between 1963 to 1972 are mostly lost. Some recordings have been
<http://www.stripes.com/news/afn-discovers-johnny-carson-footage-thought-to-be-lost-forever-1.191760>
As a person who maintains archives of everything of interest to me,
it pains me to read above there are people who don't care about archives.

I've seen that same attitude in all the Yahoo groups except the ones
I own and/or moderate. A friend in the UK and I have found a way to
say "FUCK YOU" to Yahoo and download message archives in the original
form from all groups of interest. Marissa Mayer can go pound sand.

The hot steaming pile of pig shit NEO interface to Yahoo groups renders
group message archives essentially unreadable thanks to the asshat clown
who wrote the following:

http://yahoogroups.tumblr.com/post/75580353805/your-group-homepage-photo-is-back

whose LinkedIn profile reveals he is incompetent to be the Product Leader
of Yahoo groups.

Thad
David Kaye
2014-09-29 06:19:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thad Floryan
As a person who maintains archives of everything of interest to me,
it pains me to read above there are people who don't care about archives.
There are 3 reasons I have used Usenet and continue to use it:

(1) Nobody's in control, so posts in a discussion are not going to be purged
because somebody doesn't like what's being said.

(3) There are extremely knowledgeable people on several of the newsgroups
that I don't find elsewhere, or at least without having to dig through piles
of crap posts.

And finally, the most important part:
(3) I figured early on that Usenet is forever because there are so many
servers in so many places. Microsoft "shut down" its unmoderated
newsgroups, but all it meant was the MS stopped contributing to them and
shut down their servers. But the newsgroups still exist. Stuff I wrote in
the early 1990s is still out there (well at least on Google Groups).





---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com
John Slade
2014-09-28 21:10:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Kaye
I don't think we have to worry much about network television, music and
movies being lost because current technologies and methods will ensure
that data will be around for a long time to come.
On the other hand, Johnny Carson hosted the Tonight Show for 30 years and
yet very few hours of the show remain. NBC recorded over many of the shows
because 2-inch videotape of show length was expensive. Likewise, Group W
(now CBS) erased most of the 30 years of Merv Griffin's shows.
Yea that's a real shame. A lot of old shows were
overwritten because of expensive media. One show it was done on
was Dr. Who many of the first shows are lost forever because the
tapes were recorded over. I do believe they still have the
scripts, that were of course written on paper.

BTW. I love digital books, they're convenient. However I
do still by hardcover and sometimes paperback books at greatly
reduced prices. I love to read hardcover books because all I
need is light and it's easier on the eyes. Besides if we have
some sort of EOTW apocalyptic event, the books will still be around.

John
Thad Floryan
2014-09-28 21:27:04 UTC
Permalink
[...]
BTW. I love digital books, they're convenient. However I do still
by hardcover and sometimes paperback books at greatly reduced prices. I
love to read hardcover books because all I need is light and it's easier
on the eyes. Besides if we have some sort of EOTW apocalyptic event, the
books will still be around.
Hi John,

Ever see the TWILIGHT ZONE episode "TIME ENOUGH AT LAST"
which depicts the EOTW (End Of The World) with one human
survivor who is everjoyed he now has time to read all the
books in the library ... and then he breaks his glasses
and cannot read anything -- that would be hell.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_Enough_at_Last

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0734683/ wow, 9.1 rating

3 minute extract of sad ending

Thad
John Slade
2014-09-29 18:41:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thad Floryan
[...]
BTW. I love digital books, they're convenient. However I do still
by hardcover and sometimes paperback books at greatly reduced prices. I
love to read hardcover books because all I need is light and it's easier
on the eyes. Besides if we have some sort of EOTW apocalyptic event, the
books will still be around.
Hi John,
Ever see the TWILIGHT ZONE episode "TIME ENOUGH AT LAST"
which depicts the EOTW (End Of The World) with one human
survivor who is everjoyed he now has time to read all the
books in the library ... and then he breaks his glasses
and cannot read anything -- that would be hell.
One of my fav episodes. I used to watch the reruns on
KOFY TV 20 back in the 80s. I remember Burgess Meredith was in
"Time Enough At Last".

BTW. I've listened to a few of the new Twilight Zone
audio dramas that are hosted by Stacy Keach. Some are pretty
good. A few radio stations broadcast them mostly on weekends.

John
Boris
2014-09-29 20:03:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thad Floryan
[...]
BTW. I love digital books, they're convenient. However I do still
by hardcover and sometimes paperback books at greatly reduced prices.
I love to read hardcover books because all I need is light and it's
easier on the eyes. Besides if we have some sort of EOTW apocalyptic
event, the books will still be around.
Hi John,
Ever see the TWILIGHT ZONE episode "TIME ENOUGH AT LAST"
which depicts the EOTW (End Of The World) with one human
survivor who is everjoyed he now has time to read all the
books in the library ... and then he breaks his glasses
and cannot read anything -- that would be hell.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_Enough_at_Last
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0734683/ wow, 9.1 rating
http://youtu.be/UAxARJyaTEA 3 minute extract of sad ending
Thad
My favorite, and how ironic.

Loading...